Let me start with this one

[yellowpages]

I did not post this on the other board...getting too old for the flack.

Given the forever ongoing opinion of local Abaconians regarding the issue of "foreigners" and crawfish collecting I thought it very not "PC" to post pix of large batches of the bugs gathered by non-Bahamians. Surely, any local seeing it will have his/her opinion reinforced that Bahaminans who rely on an income from this source are being hurt by "tourists" and will further their desire to have the Bahamas government ban outright all gathering of crawfish in Bahamian waters. Just doesn't seem to make sense in this case to flaunt it if you got it.

My never too humble opinion.:rolleyes:

YP

[it'lldo]

I did kinda cringe when I saw that picture and I did imagine how a local might feel about that. So I guess that means we agree. To take so many and then to flaunt it was poor judgement used by that person. I really expected a comment along these lines to end up in that thread (although it could have and been moderated) but I suspect the local boys avoid the board due to the fact that it mostly American tourist. I am guessing that when someone makes a decision to do something so abusive that they are just completely naive to the sitution. At least that is what I want to believe, and not that they are just blatantly flaunting it. Seems though that someone with such obviuos skill at collecting them would have a idea of just what exactly is going on. Pity.

[Luff'em]

Little suprised also that no one took exception. That was a little much for personal use.

[South Pause]

I was under the misconception that the picture of the huge pile of lobster was of some Bahamians coming back from one of the first days of lobster season with their catch. If not, isn't that well over the limit??

[it'lldo]

I think you are right about that first picture Norvell. I was referring to the picture further down the thread. Yellowpages??

[yellowpages]

...that shows the mass of crawfish is certainly a commercial catch.
Posts and pix about how many were grabbed by tourists, have been appearing for some time. I was bringing up the subject in general and was motivated by the current post. My feeling is that to post about your great crawfish success, and I suppose conch as well, is to bring up a subject surely sore to many locals and serves nobody well. I understand that most on the board don't think about things like this but if you've been around long enough you do.

YP

[SamFamAustin]

I appreciate the frank discussion ... yes, there was a picture of six bugs and a can of Budweiser and then what looked like a commercial catch on the floor of a fish house. That begs the question of how commercial folks sell their bugs - are they shipped just tails on ice or frozen? I ask this because "up north" we had to keep the lobsters alive for resale, no dead bugs allowed no-how.

What can happen is that the Ministry might look at that kind of stuff and say "See, I told you, those tourists are pillaging our crawdads!" Unfortunately, a picture is worth a thousand words. Perhaps all this is a little over-heated but yes, images do stick in the mind.

I feel the same way when I see folks coming in to dock with six huge dolphins (Mahi-Mahi), like 45-90 pounds each. It would take the crew maybe a month to eat all that stuff! Me, I catch one big one and have a neighborhood party, since I know that freezing fish is no good.

It is like "Hey Arnold, how are ya doing? Good to see ya. Say can you hold onto this dolphin burger for a minute? Oops, got to get back to the BBQ, see you on the water tomorrow, Arnold."

OK, a funny, but I wonder how much of the "tourist bugs" are really taken care of, served within a day or two of the catch. I'm sure most old-timers are quick about it and don't waste any food. Sorry for the ... hey this is the "rant" section, right? /Sam

[SusieAndAl]

[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]YP, you make an excellent point. Maybe a thread could be started up listing a few polite suggestions for tourists and visitors so they don

[CR]

Yellowpages,

The Crawfish in the picture I posted on the other board were taken by Bahamians from Cherokee.
I also posted that they were taken by "Cherokee Boys".


Any of you who know me - know that I am probably the biggest proponent of limiting foreign take of Bahamian resources, and protecting the environment.


Commercial fishermen freeze the Crawfish in large "kits" which are plastic bags that hold around 20# each. Upon returning home the catch is unloaded at the Fish House to be re-packaged and sold - mostly to Europe


Regards,
R.

[patw]

The locals do read this board and the other board, some religiously. I've joined many a discussion under the Fig Tree about something that was posted on the boards.


I did kinda cringe when I saw that picture and I did imagine how a local might feel about that. So I guess that means we agree. To take so many and then to flaunt it was poor judgement used by that person. I really expected a comment along these lines to end up in that thread (although it could have and been moderated) but I suspect the local boys avoid the board due to the fact that it mostly American tourist. I am guessing that when someone makes a decision to do something so abusive that they are just completely naive to the sitution. At least that is what I want to believe, and not that they are just blatantly flaunting it. Seems though that someone with such obviuos skill at collecting them would have a idea of just what exactly is going on. Pity.

[yellowpages]

You did say the "Cherokee boys" (and not too many tourists wear the rubber boots:)). As I said...I've been wanting to make the point for some time and that thread brought it to the forefront for me.

Susie and Al...your points are well taken (as long as slow doesn't include the other "s" word..."sullen"). It has been my experience that along with the foodstuffs available in markets being vastly better than years ago the service people have also been coached and have improved. Many realize that it's all "show business" to a degree and treat the customers accordingly. They also realize that what goes around comes around (in the form of increased and returning patronage not to speak of tips where warranted.)

YP

[it'lldo]

The locals do read this board and the other board, some religiously. I've joined many a discussion under the Fig Tree about something that was posted on the boards.
oh well, it was really just wishful thinking on my part. I am aware that a great deal of locals do frequent the boards but had hoped that those hard working fishermen avoided us.(ya know... the guys that really need all those lobster) Because we are- most of us so niave.

[peterodgers]

hi CR,

i'd be interested in an enviornmentally concerned Bahamian commercial fisherman's position on all of those undersized crawfish taken by Bahamian commercial fisherman during the open season.

it is well known there are thousands of under sized tails being passed around during the season. true, they're not sold but they are given to family and friends.

all these baby crawfish prematurely taken out of ciruclulation must negatively affect future years' catch, don't you think?

this would seem to be a huge consideration but it seems that is never talked about ....

what's your position?

Yellowpages,

The Crawfish in the picture I posted on the other board were taken by Bahamians from Cherokee.
I also posted that they were taken by "Cherokee Boys".


Any of you who know me - know that I am probably the biggest proponent of limiting foreign take of Bahamian resources, and protecting the environment.


Commercial fishermen freeze the Crawfish in large "kits" which are plastic bags that hold around 20# each. Upon returning home the catch is unloaded at the Fish House to be re-packaged and sold - mostly to Europe


Regards,
R.

[CR]

Mr. Rodgers,

Come the first day of August each year - every Bahamian with the means to reach the Crawfish becomes “a Commercial Fisherman”.
Along with all the Bahamian citizens most tourists and second home owners try their hand at Crawfishing as well.
I am sure that plenty of under-measure Crawfish are taken, but most are taken by non-licensed amateur “Commercial Fishermen” for sale to other Bahamians, Tourists, and Second homeowners.
Under-measure Crawfish can not be sold to the Fish Houses used by Commercial Fishermen, plus the possession of these Crawfish would lead to immediate arrest, and the confiscation of boats, and equipment.
Commercial Fishermen rely on Crawfishing as their main, or in some cases their sole means of income, and therefore care a little more than amateur “Commercial Fishermen” about the health and welfare of the fisheries.
The Fishermen I know would not risk their vessels, and freedom for under-measure Crawfish that can’t even be sold when simple diligence provides legal Crawfish that can be sold.
American vessels may not be boarded and checked with any frequency, but Bahamian Crawfishing Boats are boarded and searched all the time, and they would be caught, and the vessels impounded if it was as common as you are implying.
Did you see any under-measure Crawfish in any of my pictures? I know you did not because there was not a single one to be seen.

Since you seem to know all about these illegal practices – how many times have you called Fisheries to report these crimes? The Police? Anyone at all to help?

I am not a Commercial Fisherman, but I do enjoy tending boat for friends who are, and I can say without doubt that I have never taken a single under-measure Crawfish or been on any boat at any time that possessed any.

R.

[peterodgers]

CR, you make a very plausible argument for the non-licensed amateur "commercial fisherman" being the major source of the "shorts". the ones i have noticed were being given by BFOAFs (Bahamian friends of a friend) to BFOAFs.

and, yes, i admit to being officially silent about my observations.

(and, by the way, i don't eat crawfish myself.)

thanks for your insights.

[Abacobrad]

Nice to see a little banter here. I have speared less than 10 crawfish in my life so I represent the novice / tourist / 2nd homeowner on this one. I am more concerned about poaching out of season and people harvesting others traps. That hurts the commercial fisherman probably more than the occasional tourist taking undersized bugs. I have been around on Aug 1 a handful of times and it always reminds me of the first day of trout season when I was a kid. Anyone with a rod and a ride was fishing. No doubt undersize bugs are bagged during the frenzy of the hunt. Frankly I have trouble finding, spearing and grabbing them than judging its tail length. But hey we've eaten every one I've ever speared the day it was taken and I've never really seen a tourist with any sizeable haul either. We do buy frozen tails to take home to envious neighbors as often as we can.

[SamFamAustin]

After being "outted" as a senior I am reluctant to post much before you all catch up. I just turned 50 to I don't want to rush things! ;)

But can you imagine using a sling or pole for the bugs and coming up with a short or two? Gosh, should I throw it back into the ocean ... or just sneak the bug home and boil him real quick for some crawdad sandwiches?

I always feel bad when I catch something undersized and know it is almost dead from the fight. I wish I could keep it. Here in the US I know I could get fined, loose my catch, and even have some gear impounded. So I watch the poor critter drift away ...

Since this is a Rant section, I think we need to look at new ways to minimize by-catch, those shorts and unintended species that end up dead. If it is truly near-dead stuff, I think we should be forced to eat it!
:eek:

[NCDD]

got to agree Sam about the small ones. I still see people killing Barracudas. Just doesn't make sense.
We will leave the hook in and cut the line. They say that the hook does less damage before rusting away, than try to get it out. Also J hooks do a little less damage

[DrRalph]

Well, that's the reasoning behind Florida law that says you have to measure the critter with a gauge before you take him out of the water. It's a lot harder to tickle and net them than it is to harpoon them, but at least you don't kill shorts.

[badfish]

I have not speared a creawfish in 15 years, yet my family has devoured many. We have never taken a live conch- nor would I really know how to clean 'em up. No one who can afford a trip to the out islands or who boats over on a Hatteras relies on their catch to pay their bills or feed their family. Why not hit the restaurants and seafood market and contribute to the local economy. Overfishing and greed will kill the fisheries much like it has in New England. Of course this opinion is only mine - an American. Happy New Year!
BADFISH
PS> Its nice to have this new board. Real people with important issues should be heard, not moderated. Hats off to this board.

[SamFamAustin]

I read earlier about the "manly" way to catch crawdad, which was described by DrRalph as "tickle and net" or something like that. This is more common in Florida, where by the way the Queen Conch fishery is completely closed due to over-fishing.

Anyway, with the new crawdad rules and the tickle-net approach, it can be quite a challenge and a lot of fun, not that I've done it in a dinosaur's age. For a critter with a brain about the size of half a pea, the crawdad can be quite the formidable adversary! :)

So like a lot of us that went from bait to artificial lures, maybe try the ultimate crawdad sport, free-handing with a net - and lose the harpoon thang. It can be just as fun.

And nobody is going to call you a sissie, either. ;)
Sammie

[BahamaAngie]

Sam, why is it not good to freeze fish? Boy, I hope when we get there we can just buy wahoo. Have the hardest time buying it! It is our favorite. We have actually purchased frozen mahi but being we will be doing a week in MH I am hoping we will be able to buy more fresh fish. It it is very difficult to purchase fresh fish in TC. Any advice will be appreciated.

[SamFamAustin]

Frozen fish? Some fish freezes better than others but what happens is that ice crystals form in the meat, which causes the fish to lose some of its sweet, light texture. In prolonged freezing, oxidation can occur, which imparts a cardboard-like taste (for this reason, some freeze fish in water containers). There is nothing wrong with freezing fish, as it could spoil very easily and cause serious grastronomical injury!

That said, the best tasting fish has never been frozen or sat in ice very long - some fish snobs will even go as far to say that "ice had never touched this fish." The way to do that is to simply leave the ice in the bag when in the cooler. Soaking in ice tends to add freshwater to the meat, making it softer (crawdads have firmer meat, OK).

Often we will fish and if we get something pretty good, will go right home and clean the fish, putting the filets in plastic bags to refrigerate until dinner. A popular English recipe for smaller "panfry" fish is to gut and scale them, leaving the fish whole for the BBQ or pot. Some of us can detect a big difference between 4-hour fresh fish and older fish that has been frozen or iced for a long time. The older fish is good - it's just not great like the first day it was caught.

Ask around. There are people who hate the idea of freezing so bad they will give fish meat away. Imagine you had some Ahi-grade Yellowfin Tuna. It would be a mortal sin to freeze that fish, especially with its high fat content. I know it is expensive but at least once, try fishing for a few on a boat rental or charter, and I guarantee you will not be disappointed. /Sam
;)

[South Pause]

Obviously it would not be practical to bring a vacuum sealing machine for freezing, but we bought a cheap one and keep it at our house on Guana and it really makes a difference, in taking all of the air out of the bags that come with the machine as you freeze the fish.

We also like gutting and scaling whole fish, particularly yellowtail snapper, and cooking it whole on the grill with lots of dry spices on the skin, and stuffing the cavity with lime. Delish!

[islandfever]

I remember the year when the ban on collecting conch in Florida was implemented. It was approximately 25 years ago! The question is "Has it made any difference in the conch population?" I am not being argumentative. I just do not know the answer. Also, have there been any attemps at "seeding" in either Florida or Bahamas?

[jersey devil]

I have seen the conch making a comeback in the keys. There probably will never be enough for a harvest but it is nice to see them coming back.

[Island Daze]

Fever they have tried seeding in the keys and i so far hasn't worked.I guess something that slow and dumb just doen't get it.By the way do you feel like you are in the crosshairs of some people?