Boating question/advice needed. [Archive]

SamFamAustin

12-04-2008, 11:31 AM

Good luck on you quest! Right now is a buyer's market and many folks are desperate to almost give you a boat.

My druthers would be to do some research on the better hull designs first, such as The Hull Truth (http://www.thehulltruth.com/). Some hulls such as the Albury and DrRalph's Attitude are very, very good. The Blackfin (http://www.blackfinboats.com/) is also highly rated by some, such as for an offshore combi (fishing and sedan). Hydrosport is built like brick Ess-House. Let's just say that some hulls just aren't all that great, in construction or performance.

Next I'd look at power packages. Here I am biased towards inboard diesel engines if that's an option - the fuel and maintenance is more but the fuel economy can't be beat. The outboards such as the Yamaha are excellent but are known as being candy for thieves. The Mercruiser I/O can be good but can develop mechanical issues - do your own research and don't be biased like me!

Now you're ready to make offers. If I can tell a story on my brother, he made an offer on a boat show demo, fully equipped and used for rides in the harbor. He was about 10 grand low, but that's OK ... several months later he got a call saying he could have the boat for 20 grand off the price if he'd pull the darn thing off his parking lot. -sam

p.s., I'm looking for a Southern converted diesel lobsterboat myself, 18 knots tops and a huge fuel tank, ready to fish!

DrRalph

12-04-2008, 02:31 PM

If your trip is approx 100nm, and you carry 53 gallons of fuel, you will need to get 2 nm/gal, and that's with no reserve. I have run a 23-foot center console with a 2-stroke 200 hp outboard, and reported a fuel efficiency in flat water of about 1.6 nmpg. Four stroke outboards and inboards often will get a little better fuel economy than 2-strokes of similar power rating, but your engine is bigger, and your hull is probably not as hydrodynamically efficient, especially in head seas. My guess is that on an average day, say 2-4' seas, you will not be able to run at 25 kts, you'll have to slow down, and your fuel efficiency will drop as your hull fights the seas. I am relatively confident that on many days, you would not make it. In a boat like that, I would want to carry 125-150 gallons to make that trip.

SamFamAustin

12-04-2008, 07:59 PM

I'm not sure about which model Sapelo Son has, but the Contender (23 and over) will pack at least 175 gallons of fuel. This is another of the "top shelf" boats that went way beyond the innovations of the Boston Whaler offshore designs. Now THAT boat would make it. Only problem is it is about a hundred grand. But there are other similar makes and models that don't come with a Mercedes Benz price.

I'd like to advise people that packing along extra fuel on deck is a not-so-good idea. There are illegal Jerry cans (no offense Jerry), Coast Guard approved metal and plastic containers, and even fuel bladders resembling a balloon. None of them are ideal and siphoning fuel in a big sea is usually a total mess. It's no fun because you can't smoke cigars, the fuel stinks, and the weight of a bunch of the stuff on deck can be an issue in big seas. The mad Texans who go out to the +100-mile drill rigs in a 26 foot boat by packing fuel on deck are totally insane and please do not imitate them. :eek:

razorren

12-04-2008, 10:16 PM

Thanks for the feedback guys.
I was also considering this one...

Year: 2005
Engine: 350HP Mercury outboard.
Fuel: 160L

I'm looking for something as a recreational means to spend time with my wife and kids. Not too many long trips...

http://www.boatsdepot.org/photos/2008/11/3238.1.9566.450.jpg

Rock Steady

12-05-2008, 07:39 AM

I'm not sure that you want to chance it with that amount of fuel capacity. I wouldn't...it's big water out there, not to mention the family.

Stuff happens.

That also looks like an I/O to me and if it has a rubber housing melding the lower unit to the stern that could also cause problems for you.

Based on my experiences, deisels or reputable true outboard engines are the way to go in Abaco.

rs

ReadytoEat

12-05-2008, 11:50 AM

Buy a Straight Outboard or Inboard. E-tecs are nice.

I don't like that hull design. Reminds me of a Bayliner.

How do you say it ?: Fluff Boat.

:eek:

sail pending

12-05-2008, 11:54 AM

I would have to agree with Rock Steady. There is a reason that you don't see alot of inboard/outboards in Abaco. They can be problematic in shallow saltwater.This might be good baot to bring over for a trip or two, but not an ideal rig to explore the sea of Abaco. I would suggest something with good outboard power, a true self bailing deck and a tight bilge that lacks an engine block.

SamFamAustin

12-05-2008, 01:19 PM

Let's be nice - some people like the Bayliner concept just fine as an inshore party boat for short cruises, and for that it is just fine, especially with a good deal on the price.

And even me, with all my connoisseur boating tastes, have a budget that puts me in the fixer-up category.

But I guess what got our attention was the idea of making a trip from Nassau to the Abaco - our sailor bells were going "ding-ding-ding." Well that means we care, and we're not trying to sound like some hardy-har blow-hards.

I'm almost going to say to either buy a Nassau party boat and keep it within 20 miles of port ... or take a captained charter to try such a long passage because the route is quite tricky, and the safe harbors with fuel are few. If you're still game for a long-running offshore boat, there are plenty of good recommendations here. -sam

Patti Puzo

12-05-2008, 02:03 PM

It doesn't take much to keep me happy:D

Sapelo Son

12-05-2008, 02:30 PM

I have a friend here in Georgia that has family in Freeport. He is about 35 or so and has a family of young boys ages 4 thru about 9. They purchased a boat similar to the ones you are looking at, a 27' Sea Ray with about 85gl fuel capacity. They love their boat. They make mostly inter-coastal trips on it but also have, a couple of times, taken it to the islands. He will tell you it is not a "big water" boat. It does great everywhere else and they do fish it some. It has hot water and AC when docked or on a small generator they place on the dive platform. It does get about 2.5 miles per gallon which is better that most outboards but, puts him close on long trips. For what they do it is a perfect fit. As the boys get older and want to do more "hard core" stuff, he will need a lot more boat.......but for now, they are fine.

Now, with that said, if you want a "real boat" call me, mine is for sale.

AbacoBoy

12-05-2008, 09:09 PM

I would totally agree with previous posters re: fuel capacity. 53 gallons doesn't seem like nearly enough to feel comfortable. I don't subscribe to any hard and fast prescriptions for size and style of boat that would be appropriate necessarily, but fuel economy is relatively easy to calculate and add a reasonable measure of margin for conditions. I make crossings myself that some people might see as questionable, but never without serious consideration of fuel requirements. It's not something that you can ever guess at. I would suggest that you might want to spend lots of time negotiating with mother nature much closer to port before you attempt anything as adventurous as Nassau to Abaco.

AB

gettin-there

12-05-2008, 10:58 PM

Everbody here speak da truth: If it isn't clear, that type of boat isn't up to par for what mother nature puts your way.

53 gal fuel capacity isn't near enough. I made a crossing 2 years ago in a 23' refurbed mako and had a 96 gal tank. we made it from west palm to Treasure but we were on fumes when we got there. wouldn't do it again in a boat that size - even with knowing everything was in order from gel coat to radios.

Go full blown outboards on anything less than 30'. if greater than 30, you'll be lookin at a sportfisher (diesel inboards) or a serious blue water hull w/ serious updated outboards. Bayliner type hull/boat does not equal long term out island boats.

it is understated the corrosive evironment/elements that boats in the bahamas endure.
a quick survey of boats that have longevity (hulls) in the out islands include:
Albury
boston Whaler
jupiter
wellcraft
Pursuit
edgewater
mako
grady
Triton
hydro sp.
and other names long in the tooth.

as for power, I think you'll find most outboards get a lower unit every 2-4 years. powerheads; kinda depends on hp and use. there's some ole 2 stroke 25-50 hps out there strokin on 10 yrs or better. for the occaisinal user of 150 hp and up 2 and 4 strokers, 5 years is a bonus. you'll see very few inboard/outboards in the out islands. that isn't saying they aren't bad boats, just ya see a whole lot of whalers, alburys, pursuits, etc w/ matched outboards...... gotta go with what works|!

summation: forget pretty, its all about lasting endurance......

Sapelo Son

12-05-2008, 11:31 PM

Every post is right on the mark. Before you buy, look at an older Grady White of the same $ value. You can get a lot of boat for not much money and like Sammie said, it's a buyers market, don't get in a hurry!

razorren

12-06-2008, 08:39 AM

I really appreciate the advice from everyone
Perhaps i should have noted at the beginning of the post that i am a 100% newbie to the boating stuff (ex-land-lover).

Would you mind giving your opinion on these last two...

29.7ft Sea Ray
Mercruiser Twin 255hp engines

http://www.iboats.com/sites/firstcoastboat/site_page_11232/images/l_11-4-08001.jpg

http://www.iboats.com/sites/firstcoastboat/site_page_11232/images/l_11-4-08004.jpg

http://www.iboats.com/sites/firstcoastboat/site_page_11232/images/l_11-4-08013.jpg

27ft Bayliner
Engine Type: Stern Drive - I/O

http://www.iboats.com/sites/wherrena/site_page_8500/images/l_digi29471078.jpg

http://www.iboats.com/sites/wherrena/site_page_8500/images/l_digi29471082.jpg

http://www.iboats.com/sites/wherrena/site_page_8500/images/l_digi29471094.jpg

SamFamAustin

12-06-2008, 01:47 PM

It's OK, looks like you like a certain kind. My taste runs sorta like this, unless I'm going offshore of course. ;)

DrRalph

12-06-2008, 02:00 PM

Again, these are comfortable boats, nice for family outings, overnights, etc., but they are really not what you want to play hardball with. If your primary use for a proposed vessel is frequent offshore long distance travel, these boats will generally not do well. They won't have the range, they won't handle rough seas.

razorren

12-06-2008, 04:42 PM

Even for Nassau to Rose island or Nassau to SPanish Wells?

:(

Long Look

12-07-2008, 02:15 AM

Take a look at some express sportfishing boats or something like a grady white.

AbacoBoy

12-07-2008, 07:02 AM

You clearly have no idea of what you are considering. Don't even think about an ocean crossing until you have years of boating experience very close to shore.

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 01:59 PM

You clearly have no idea of what you are considering. Don't even think about an ocean crossing until you have years of boating experience very close to shore.

what he said.....

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 02:38 PM

hey Razor,
Everybodys tryin to help here right? you first posted a 'bayliner' fluff type boat. several 'seaworthy' comments came back per your request for advice. and BTW there is a lot of sea worthy salts on this board, much more than I, but as stated numberous times, it seems that most of the responders were agreeing with each other as to what type of boat to consider.

Then, after mentioning you are a newbie to boating and that you are looking to make a crossing with kids... I think you got everybodys attention.. Making a crossing, can be a great and memorable experience. there are ones on this board that have done that numerouse times.

As far a crossings go, though from the states (so. fla.) to abaco is a longer trip, the crossing from Nassau to Abaco is much more dangerous. Mainly because of traffic. there's a whole lot more traffic from Southern Florida to west end than Nassau to Abaco. That there alone accounts for some insurance. BTW the traffic you might encounter from Nassau to Abaco might not be the kind you want to encounter. Especially if they see you in the small pleasure boater craft (ie easy target)

After numerous suggestions , your later posts of the same type of boats has got me and likely others wondering:
Are you hearing what everybody is saying? Forget the inboard stern drive type unless you're looking at a serious sport fishier.

Here's the problem with the bayliner type boats you keep posting: you get outta sight of land, seas go from 2-4's to 4-6's with a tight frequency. your screwed. you take a few splashes over the rail from a quartering sea, a bunch of seawater ends up down in the hull where that engine is....wooops uhhhh. you're putting a whole lotta faith in the bilge.... and what if the engine quits. "what are we gonna do now, honey? , the kids are scared...., I'm scare....who can we call for help?...."
Not where ya wanna be. and it happens. and it happens with more experienced captains on better crafts. A friend of a friend took a rouge wave over the bow just off of west end in a seaworthy 27' center console two years ago. it went down fast. He was running with another boat, otherwise loss of life would be inevitable. You want a self bailing deck that can get rid of some water in a hurry. If a couple of 20-30 gal waves are breaking into your boat, you gotta get it out fast.

Not deliberately going for the scare tactic here but the open seas are a serious matter. you want to put as many things inyour favor as you can.
As simply and plainly as I can put it:
go with an offshore hull ( grady and express/sportfishers are mentioned numerous times), go with twin outboards, go with a flat sea forcast, and Most importantly first go with another boat, or don't go at all.

'it's better to be here on land wishin you were out there (blue water)... than being out there ... prayin to God for your life that you were here".

Sapelo Son

12-07-2008, 04:04 PM

I really like the one with the wires comin' outta the back, I think I'd buy that one but, your gonna need a very long extention cord. How far did you say you planned to travel?

I just had to look at the calendar, it aint' April, is it????????

razorren

12-07-2008, 04:46 PM

Sorry if I sounded like the student that just wont listen...thats not the case. Yes, I am new to this and fully understand and agree with what you all are saying. And I was not saying that I intended such a long trip right away...just trying to think long term i guess...and getting caught up in the excitement of perhaps owning a boat.

I mentioned 'Nassau to Rose Isl.' or 'Nassau to Spanish Wells' because I was thinking purely in terms of distance (newbie again) and not in terms ocean conditions that would effect the journey.
But considering everything that you all said, cost of the boat/fuel, and my experience (yes, lack of)...I'm thinking something simple were we stay not too far from land (no deep blue crossings) would be best.

Outside of the technicalities, it seems like a nice tool to for a dad, mom and two 4 year old boys to spend time together and make some memories.

Ren :cool:

hey Razor,
Everybodys tryin to help here right? you first posted a 'bayliner' fluff type boat. several 'seaworthy' comments came back per your request for advice. and BTW there is a lot of sea worthy salts on this board, much more than I, but as stated numberous times, it seems that most of the responders were agreeing with each other as to what type of boat to consider.

Then, after mentioning you are a newbie to boating and that you are looking to make a crossing with kids... I think you got everybodys attention.. Making a crossing, can be a great and memorable experience. there are ones on this board that have done that numerouse times.

As far a crossings go, though from the states (so. fla.) to abaco is a longer trip, the crossing from Nassau to Abaco is much more dangerous. Mainly because of traffic. there's a whole lot more traffic from Southern Florida to west end than Nassau to Abaco. That there alone accounts for some insurance. BTW the traffic you might encounter from Nassau to Abaco might not be the kind you want to encounter. Especially if they see you in the small pleasure boater craft (ie easy target)

After numerous suggestions , your later posts of the same type of boats has got me and likely others wondering:
Are you hearing what everybody is saying? Forget the inboard stern drive type unless you're looking at a serious sport fishier.

Here's the problem with the bayliner type boats you keep posting: you get outta sight of land, seas go from 2-4's to 4-6's with a tight frequency. your screwed. you take a few splashes over the rail from a quartering sea, a bunch of seawater ends up down in the hull where that engine is....wooops uhhhh. you're putting a whole lotta faith in the bilge.... and what if the engine quits. "what are we gonna do now, honey? , the kids are scared...., I'm scare....who can we call for help?...."
Not where ya wanna be. and it happens. and it happens with more experienced captains on better crafts. A friend of a friend took a rouge wave over the bow just off of west end in a seaworthy 27' center console two years ago. it went down fast. He was running with another boat, otherwise loss of life would be inevitable. You want a self bailing deck that can get rid of some water in a hurry. If a couple of 20-30 gal waves are breaking into your boat, you gotta get it out fast.

Not deliberately going for the scare tactic here but the open seas are a serious matter. you want to put as many things inyour favor as you can.
As simply and plainly as I can put it:
go with an offshore hull ( grady and express/sportfishers are mentioned numerous times), go with twin outboards, go with a flat sea forcast, and Most importantly first go with another boat, or don't go at all.

'it's better to be here on land wishin you were out there (blue water)... than being out there ... prayin to God for your life that you were here".

Sapelo Son

12-07-2008, 05:18 PM

Hey Razzen, you are exactly correct in that it is a tool for togetherness. Far more than you can even imagine! It will be the best times of all your lives and will make memories that will last not only your lifetime but, those of your family too. If you are serious about what you are doing then answer these questions for us:

1.) Where is your home port?
2.) What is your budget?
3.) What is the level of current boating ability?
4.) What type of hobies do you now have?
5.) What is your level of mechanical ability?
6.) What are things you'd like to do with the boat?

If you are truly asking our advice and would like the help of seasoned veterans, we can help you but, you've got to listen and not get your feelings hurt when we tell you, your full of *@*!. (It's only because we care.) Why, one of us might let you tag along and learn a few things.

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 05:20 PM

Outside of the technicalities, it seems like a nice tool to for a dad, mom and two 4 year old boys to spend time together and make some memories.

There's no better way/place to create the best momories of all....

Boats......a true symbol of freedom(see: kenney chesney lucky ole sun song.)

We all gotta learn somehow. I would encourage anybody interested to get a boat. It's more fun than you can imagine. (its also more $$$$ than you can imagine) . Being on the boat - especially in the bahamas.... what can I say.....Priceless. Yes. get a boat. tool around Nassau, do some explorin' an stuff. Yeah, even the bayliner/cruiser type-if thats what you want- it can be fun.. anchor up somewhere, ya got that cabin thing goin'.....maybe wifey may wanna do an overniter in safe anchorage.. : )

But to the point I was trying to make- as for a crossing -( Nassau to Abaco is a full blown crossing of open seas) - look for a different type boat or REALLY pick your days. That's serious stuff out there in the deep blue.

Yeah, I've scared myself a few times...small boat-big water. get out there(within sight of land), get some experience - ....then..... evaluate the best boat for your needs :)

you gotta start somewhere. the first boat won't be your last. get started......

DrRalph

12-07-2008, 06:09 PM

Ren, I think the "passion" you are seeing in this thread stems from the juxtaposition of a love of boating and a healthy respect for what can happen out there when things go wrong. And things will go wrong, and they will go wrong at the wrong time and in the wrong way. You have to be ready for that eventuality, you have to know how to handle it, you have to have good equipment. When you enter the ocean, whether it's the Straits of Florida or the NW Providence Channel, you have to be educated, experienced, and prepared, especially if you are involving your family.

Twenty years after the fact my kids still tell me they have great memories of boating in the Keys and the Bahamas. But we did it right, we knew what we were doing, and we made sure they were safe. You have to do the same; that's why we get a little wound up about this issue.

SamFamAustin

12-07-2008, 06:27 PM

Well I want to tell you a story about the old days when I was about 14 years old. My dad had a 21-foot North Carolina sprit-sailed skiff with a 1-1/2 HP Seagull motor on the back, a sailboat. The trip from Clinton, CT to Block Island, RI was about 50 miles in some of the most treacherous waters of the US, including a passage called The Race where water churned and boiled in whirlpools with a current of over 5 knots.

Now dad was Coast Guard Auxiliary and quite a waterman, not a fair comparison, but for two or three years we made the trip - and the trip back home. No gas other than maybe a gallon or two. It was an open boat and sometimes we got half swamped. We rode it out in half gales and 12 foot seas but the worst was pea soup fog. We had nothing for navigation other than a portable compass, not even a radio. Of course there was no GPS back then in 1968.

And we made it just fine each time with the sails, reefed or not, and never got a tow job ever.

I guess my point is that people are wussies these days and can't navigate by the compass, the charts, and dead reckoning. The problem was that by 1970 or so, boating companies were selling cheap fiberglass boats that were what my dad called "Clorox bottles." These boats were extremely light, had no stability, and often ended upside down or totally swamped dead in the water if the weather turned foul. It happened more than people care to remember - like how the jet airliners used to fall out of the sky.

To make a long story short, a great deal of technology went into the Clorox bottle designs to make them more stable, and sailors learned how to steer extremely "tender" boats that could yaw or broach or porpoise very easily and sink. It was and is an imperfect science. Some still swear by those old wooden boats. But I just offer this as some food for thought. :)

razorren

12-07-2008, 07:03 PM

1.) Where is your home port? Nassau
2.) What is your budget? $7000
3.) What is the level of current boating ability? Zero
4.) What type of hobies do you now have? Computer guy involved with some personal construction projects, so any opportunity to relax and unwind is welcomed!
5.) What is your level of mechanical ability? Mechanical=none, studying electrical.
6.) What are things you'd like to do with the boat? Spending time fishing/exploring with the family. After years with the keyboard and mouse I am loving the outdoors more and more.

Ren

Hey Razzen, you are exactly correct in that it is a tool for togetherness. Far more than you can even imagine! It will be the best times of all your lives and will make memories that will last not only your lifetime but, those of your family too. If you are serious about what you are doing then answer these questions for us:

1.) Where is your home port?
2.) What is your budget?
3.) What is the level of current boating ability?
4.) What type of hobies do you now have?
5.) What is your level of mechanical ability?
6.) What are things you'd like to do with the boat?

If you are truly asking our advice and would like the help of seasoned veterans, we can help you but, you've got to listen and not get your feelings hurt when we tell you, your full of *@*!. (It's only because we care.) Why, one of us might let you tag along and learn a few things.

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 07:25 PM

http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1978-Robalo-Open-Fisherman-94198451

here's ya a boat.

it ain't pretty. but:

it meets your budget of $7000
its a proven hull - Robalo
it's got a low time newer engine.

perfect for toolin' around. going snorkeling off Nassau, etc.
Put a bimini top on her an you'll be a proud captain.

ps. Hey, my current boat in the bahamas is older than that one : )

bahamajb

12-07-2008, 07:45 PM

offer 3 grand....jb

Sapelo Son

12-07-2008, 08:06 PM

I am going to tell you what I think and why, I'm sure other's will do the same.

1st) Don't buy what you are looking at, you don't have (nor do I) the mechanical ablity to keep it running. You'll just be pissed off all the time because your having problems, and like doc say's, you will!

2nd) With your budget you won't be able to buy much boat, BUT, that is not a problem, and for you right now, might just be a blessing. With the lack of boating experince, you need something that is almost "bullet proof", will perform without any help, will still float after you've beached it and ran it aground, because you will.

3rd) You need something you can run fairly fast and far if the water will let you. If you live in the islands, you need and island boat. "Gettin-there" rebuilt and old Mako center console and keeps it at Treasure. I'm not sure what he had in it but, I think something like that is what you need first. You are right, you will not be making long overnight runs to start with so why worry about having a cabin.

4th) Get comfortable on the water first. Learn how to read the water, learn how to dock the boat, learn how to fish and dive before you worry about making a long voyage. By the time that all happens, you'll know what to buy.

Summary: I reccomend that you buy an older, but well made, center console with a good running outboard. Something in the 21'-23' class with maybe something like a 150-200 hp outboard and close to 100 gls of fuel. You should be able to get that for your budget pretty easy and not have to do a thing to it, except enjoy it! If you have to have a cabin boat then look hard for an old Grady White or other "good" hull like GT mentioned in his post. You can find a good older boat in your price range. This picture is my old Grady, "The Fish Hunter". It is a 1987 24' Cuddy Cabin that my family bought brand new. It was my second boat after a 21' Wellcraft center console with a 175hp outboard. I just sold this boat for about what your wanting to spend. It was sold with a lot of cosmetic work needed and a engine re-build. The folks that bought it are Yamaha mechanics and were able to do the work needed to restore her to her glory! Old boats do go to heaven, and its folks like you that take care of them there! I wish you luck in your adventure. Like GT said "just do it"...

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll239/timharris2008/WineTime.jpg

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 08:25 PM

here's that boat at TC

gettin-there

12-07-2008, 08:36 PM

it's all you really need

Long Look

12-07-2008, 10:03 PM

it's all you really need

just nowhere near as cosmetically perfect!:D

If your planning on staying in around the nassau area to go explore reefs and fish close in without heading offshore for crossings you could look at center console or dual console boats. The dual console boats are gaining popularity because they can handle the casual fisherman and accommodate the needs of the family. I know whaler, grady, pro-line, robalo and others make dual console boats. Some are equipped with things like porta-potties in the consoles or ski pylons and on the newer ones wakeboard towers are becoming common.

ReadytoEat

12-08-2008, 12:32 AM

You don't want to end up lining the bottom of a Bay.

This 20ft Grady with a single E-Tec has taken us from Jupiter to West End to Grand cay to Pete's Pub twice. Late June through July.

Good Luck !
Practice a while.
:)

concheyjoe

12-08-2008, 09:46 AM

Raz,
Our family vacation has been a trip to the Abaco for the past 8 years. It is one of the best ways to create memories. Some of our experiences are the best & some have been the worst.
My suggestion is to consider researching purchasing you dream boat from a dealer & who leads a trip to destination of your preference. Thats how we learned how to go to the Abaco then we started going on on our own.

SamFamAustin

12-08-2008, 10:32 AM

I've attached an old (sorry!) photo of one of my favorite kinds of boats, the Bertram 30. This is a classic of the 1973 vintage, and similar models seem to be in the $10-30K range - a little more than you liked, but one heck of a boat, very popular in the fish tournaments in my neck of the woods.

With any used boat, I always use the services of a reputable marine surveyor, which costs something like $500. I highly recommend one even if buying a $7K day cruiser. It's a big investment, much for than just buying the hull and engines - as any sailor can tell you - BOAT means "bust out another thousand". Maintenance and fees are big issues. :D

As hinted above, the leading cause of sinking is down-flooding by the stern. Curiously, most boats don't sink at sea but right at the dock, due to leaking thru-hull fittings. You can get a ton of water in the bilge and without warning, simply turn on its side and swamp within a few minutes. These kinds of fittings should be inspected annually by a good marina after the initial survey.

The other way to sink by down-flooding of the stern is to get "pooped" by a big wave that comes up over the stern. If the cockpit does not have self-bailing and water clearing scuppers, the boat can lose stability in seconds, not minutes. I can vouch that the Bertram excels in that department, as I've been in 10-12 foot waves in one. -sam

BahamaAngie

12-08-2008, 10:46 AM

Well our friend who knows a lot about boats always said the Bayliner bounced around a lot. I know a Sea Ray is a good boat. But like Sammie says, shop around and take your time. Look at some Four Winns they are real good boats! Good luck to you. I envy you....I love boats!

NoMoSnow

12-08-2008, 03:16 PM

Awesome posts folks. You've made me reconsider my priorities in a boat.

I've had OB's, I/O's and inboards in fresh water but I guess the salt water must have an effect on the stern drive seals. Heck, I was looking for a reason to go back to an inboard anyway!

The plan is to pick up something in S. Fla. and cross over - hire a reputable captain and we'll be the crew. I have substantial fresh water experience on large lakes where 3 - 5 foot breakers were common and with up to 32 foot boats. I can navigate "old school style" day or night, but I'm not nearly cocky enough to do a first crossing on my own.....even if accompanied by other boats.

Anyway,,, just wanted to say thanks for the wealth of info in this thread.

And Ren, good luck in your endeavors. Boating is an awesome activity, no matter where you do it.

razorren

12-08-2008, 03:21 PM

I really appreciate all the advice.
I plan on taking a marine navigation course early next year by BASRA.
This looks tempting as well... http://www.marinersecampus.com/xcart/home.php

Ren

SamFamAustin

12-08-2008, 05:18 PM

Now there's a person with a good attitude! The Coast Guard Auxiliary does a nice class on boater safety and yes you can pass an exam and get a nice certificate! See:
http://nws.cgaux.org/visitors/pe_visitor/index.html

Take at least one or two courses. This is good stuff. The classes you mentioned are mainly for commercial licensing such as for passenger, charter, and for hire. I don't think you need a commercial "ticket" and that is quite expensive. The recreational courses, the experience, and even refreshers are very good though.

You can also get voluntary inspections from the Auxiliary (usually dry land) or the Coast Guard and get a sticker for having a boat that passes the various lists, and you get a nice sticker (and a piece of mind). My brother boat a brand new boat that was supposedly up to all standards but the Coast Guard found three infractions - which he fixed, was very appreciative, and when inspected again got that nice sticker! Yes, the Coast Guard does see those things from afar.

As a plug for the Coast Guard Auxiliary, many of the old-timers are quitting and they can use all the help they can get. Experience and skill level are NOT important as much as taking the classes and going out on boats to get some experience - and meeting new people and having some fun!
-sammie

DaGoose

12-09-2008, 05:19 PM

Ren,

You really got some great advice!!!!

One thing to definitely look into is on the water towing services. Boat US is cheap insurance. I wouldn't get a boat wet without it. However I'm not certain if it's available in Nassau.

Boats are great but they do break down and when they do it's no fun, especially if you're not prepared and then get hit with a huge towing bill to get back to port on top of the cost of repairs. A throw bag with a backup submersible handheld VHF, gps and other goodies is highly recommended too. This way you will always know where you are and can communicate for assistance.

That said, don't let it scare you off. There's nothing like the feeling of freedom when you cast off and put the throttle down!!!!

Tight Lines,

Rick

gettin-there

12-09-2008, 07:12 PM

hey ren,

It didn't come to mind initially...., but I'm sure many will agree,here's the best advice: Rent.

at least at first, til ya get the hang of things and see what ya like. rent a different size/brand boat each time. get a feelin as to what you & the fam like

There are numerous reputable boat rental companies throughout Abaco. Rainbow, Rich's, Waterways, B&B, Island marine, seahorse (sorry for leavin out the others- that's just what came to mind right a way). I've rented from 3 or 4 of these folks. they have quality boats and get you up and going in a hurry. Not to mention when your're thru w/ the boat, you leave it behind (maintenance, storage, repairs, engine service..$, & $)

In the long run, there's not a savings to having your own boat for a runabout...I live in denial of that fact because I'm just too financially stupid and I don't want to admit it to myself. (whoops ... I let it out)It just pushes my buttons too much to have MY boat there. (okay, I'm not alone here....right?)

I understand you're based out of Nassau, but I'd bet there's a few rental companies there that can hook you up.

SamFamAustin

12-09-2008, 07:21 PM

Ahh, the infamous "ditch bag" and the optional life raft, of course with life jackets that the government insists upon called PFD, for personal flotation device. Don't leave home without the PFDs for everyone and a really good ditch bag - they don't teach you much about ditch bags in Coast Guard school.

A ditch bag has waterproof compartments for flares, snack bars like granola, and other essentials such as water and sunscreen, very simple. It needs to float or be tied to something that floats. Sometimes and extra Type I PFD or two are stuffed in there in case you need them. It's not a comforting thought but everyone should have a ditch bag plan, no matter who and what.

The ditch bag is not meant to be heavy, and often is carried under the Bimini top on a center console outboard boat along with other Type 1 or Type II PFDs - those ugly as sin orange thangs. But it has to be fluffy and floatie! The only heavy thing should be a flare gun and 3-4 shots. I have seen aspirin, cigarettes, fishing hooks, and even whiskey in them, though.

Remember to check the ditch bag several times a year, as the certification on the flares could expire ... and those granola bars might start tasting like pooh. Everyone has their own style but thanks to Rick for mentioning that. Well not the granola thing but you know what I mean. :eek:

So now you know more than 50 percent of what regular people know about boating. If you have the bad luck of ending up in the water, and it happens more frequently than anyone would like to admit, you need real good flotation and some goodies to help get rescued. All kids should have the kind of PFD that keeps their heads above the water, Type I or Type II. Myself, I am comfortable in a Type III that looks more like a waterski vest because I swim fairly well (inshore and on most lakes, Type III is fine for kids). Carry on, soldiers, and lets have some fun out there knowing that we're ready to rock & roll! -sammie